SCFZ

Polling the films of director Hal Hartley

The rules:

- your list can include no more than half of the Hartley films you've seen, up to a maximum of 5. So if you've seen seven of his films, for example, you can list only a top 3. It's only if you've seen ten or more of his films than you can list the maximum of five.

- i'll assume ballots are ranked unless you tell me otherwise. unranked ballots are fine.

- deadline for ballots: next Tuesday, in seven days, whatever day that is

- if anyone is watching films for these polls, then i'll extend the deadline up to three days, if someone requests an extension

- next poll: whoever posts the first ballot in this thread is free to nominate the director we poll next, unless you've nominated in this round already (everyone should get a chance). Already nominated this round: greennui, bure, roscoe, kanafani, greg x, silga, oscarwerner, john ryan

umbugbene created an index on letterboxd of all of our previous polls here: letterboxd.com/umbugbene/list/index-of-all-scfz-director-polls/

one rule for nominees: at least 3 scfzers need to have seen 10+ of a nominee's films, or at least 4 scfzers need to have seen at least 8 of the nom's films, so if it isn't clear if that will be the case, we'll confirm that's true before moving forward

if 24 hours pass after a poll opens, and no one eligible to nominate has posted a ballot, then i'll nominate someone, and then we'll start over, and everyone will be able to nominate again

Henry Fool
Amateur
Fay Grim
Simple Men
The Unbelievable Truth

seen ten

Amateur
Trust

Seen 5, love the guy.

10.

Simple Men
Surviving Desire
The Unbelievable Truth
Amateur
Theory of Achievement

trust
no such thing
ned rifle
amateur
flirt

Trust
Simple men
The unbelievable truth

zippo

will use this as a guide for getting into hal. my old rental place haunt (rip) had a hal hartley subsection once upon a time, but then they got rid of it towards the end of the ‘00s. feel that’s pretty indicative of his career trajectory. multiple films from his early output pop up on several best of lists for the ‘90s, but then he kinda fizzled out from the cultural zeitgeist. have no idea why that is since i haven’t seen any of his films, but whatever the reason(s) i’m still looking forward to checking out his stuff

nrh wrote: ↑Tue Jan 19, 2021 11:20 pmno such thing

did you notice the starman ending parallel too?

i got only four

trust
simple men

thoxans wrote: ↑Wed Jan 20, 2021 12:13 am

nrh wrote: ↑Tue Jan 19, 2021 11:20 pmno such thing

did you notice the starman ending parallel too?

not really. i guess outside of the film doing something broadly similar w/burke as the nonhuman other the movies are so different it never really came to mind. but i haven't seen starman for well over ten years at this point so it's not all that fresh in my mind, which means i should probably rewatch starman sometime soon.

thoxans wrote: ↑Wed Jan 20, 2021 12:10 am multiple films from his early output pop up on several best of lists for the ‘90s, but then he kinda fizzled out from the cultural zeitgeist. have no idea why that is since i haven’t seen any of his films, but whatever the reason(s) i’m still looking forward to checking out his stuff

no such thing definitely hurt his career, a relatively larger budgeted studio film after the success of henry fool, apparently the studio hated it and wanted him to recut him, he and coppola (who produced) refused, and they pretty much buried its theatrical release. critics hated it too, in weird ways - i remember one review that describes him as being in a career slump, despite coming directly from his biggest success.

and the two films he made directly after that - girl from monday and fay grimm - definitely alienated a lot of people even further, all digital video experimentation, angry bush era politics, weird narrative games. neither quite works for me but they are interesting movies, i kind of slot them in my head alongside boarding gate and demonlover and southland tales, if that makes sense, but people really hated them. he never really got a budget after that, with the next few films being crowdfunded through kickstarter.

Seen 9:

Trust
Henry Fool
Simple Men
Ned Rifle

"Flirt is some of the best work I've ever done. It sort of ruined my career."

Seen 12. Truly loved Hartley's stuff when he was first starting out but then I sort of thought he really just lost his way and went off the rails by the end of the nineties. I found the later trilogy [Fool-Grimm-Rifle] to be so meager compared to the early stuff. Lots of shorts, early digital and experimental pieces.

Surviving Desire
Trust
Amateur
The Unbelievable Truth
No Such Thing

Not my cup of tea. Seen 3 for today.
I vote for
Trust (1990)
Seen "Henry Fool" today specially for votes. Seems Hartley is a director, who creates same film in all of his movies.

Seen 13

1. The Unbelievable Truth
2. Amateur
3. Surviving Desire
4. No Such Thing
5. Simple Men

I like all of them though (though my least two favorites are the mid 2000's tandem, The Girl From Monday and Fay Grim).

MrCarmady wrote: ↑Tue Jan 19, 2021 11:05 pm Seen 5

your turn to pick a director, if you want to!

How about Tex Avery? I've got 8.

I've got 68.

1. Simple Men
2. Trust
3. Henry Fool

Perhaps i have seen some of his films, but it will be very difficult to figure out what films by Tex Avery i have.

I have 2 Tex Avery, though I might have seen more.

More than enough Avery, dozens I'm sure, should there be any question if he'd work.

69 Avery's

Nice, looks like he's gonna work then.
Flip, do you mind keeping this poll open until the end of the week? Don't have great internet right now but keen to see a few more Hartleys.

seen 23

1. Trust
2. Amateur
3. Simple Men
4. The Unbelievable Truth
5. Meanwhile

I remember really enjoying Fay Grimm, but I haven't seen it since 2007. Might rewatch that and finally catch Ned Rifle this week.

cool, i'll start tex avery poll tomorrow, and leave hartley open until friday (or later if people are still watching)

I'm still watching but if you wanna close it, here's an updated ballot

Amateur
Trust
Henry Fool

Watched and enjoyed Theory of Achievement, a very satisfying microcosm of Hartley's comic, philosophical, and visual sensibilities, but not quite good enough to make the top 3. Surviving Desire and Flirt next.

The Unbelievable Amateur Trust (not ranked, can't differentiate between 'em much really)

i thought henry fool would do better:

results

1. Trust (1990) — 30 pts
2. Amateur (1994) — 24 pts
3. Simple Men (1992) — 19 pts
4. The Unbelievable Truth (1989) — 16 pts
5. Surviving Desire (1993) — 12 pts
6. Henry Fool (1997) — 10 pts
7. No Such Thing (2001) — 7 pts
8. Ned Rifle (2015) — 4 pts
9. Fay Grim (2006) — 3 pts
10. Meanwhile (2011) — 1 pt
10. Flirt (1995) — 1 pt
10. Theory of Achievement (1991) — 1 pt