SCFZ poll: Mamoru Oshii

[flip]

Polling the films of director Mamoru Oshii

The rules:

- your list can include no more than half of the Oshii films you've seen, up to a maximum of 5. So if you've seen seven of his films, for example, you can list only a top 3. It's only if you've seen ten or more of his films than you can list the maximum of five.

- i'll assume ballots are ranked unless you tell me otherwise. unranked ballots are fine.

- deadline for ballots: next Friday, in seven days, whatever day that is

- if anyone is watching films for these polls, then i'll extend the deadline up to three days, if someone requests an extension

- next poll: whoever posts the first ballot in this thread is free to nominate the director we poll next, unless you've nominated in this round already (everyone should get a chance). Already nominated this round: oscarwerner, greennui, mesnalty, bure, ofrene, arkheia, brian d, rischka, twodeadmagpies, john ryan, karl, umbugbene, greg x, wba

umbugbene created an index on letterboxd of all of our previous polls here: letterboxd.com/umbugbene/list/index-of-all-scfz-director-polls/

one rule for nominees: at least 3 scfzers need to have seen 10+ of a nominee's films, or at least 4 scfzers need to have seen at least 8 of the nom's films, so if it isn't clear if that will be the case, we'll confirm that's true before moving forward

if 24 hours pass after a poll opens, and no one eligible to nominate has posted a ballot, then i'll nominate someone, and then we'll start over, and everyone will be able to nominate again

[flip]

i'm going to really slow down the pace of these polls for the next couple of weeks, partly because i'll be tallying the best-of-decade poll soon, and partly because i'm moving in to my new montreal place on jan 1st, so i've got a lot going on outside of scfz right now

so this poll will probably be open longer than the normal 7 days (maybe 14) and the edwin porter poll will stay open a little while longer too

[mesnalty]

Seen 3:

1. The Red Spectacles

[wba]

01. The Red Spectacles (1987)
02. The Sky Crawlers (2008)
03. Avalon (2001)
04. Ghost in the Shell (1995)

Oshii seen: 9

[rischka]

red spectacles

[St. Gloede]

Seen 3:

Angel's Egg

[...]

Ghost in the Shell 2: Innocence
Patlabor 2
Ghost in the Shell
Patlabor
Garm Wars: The Last Druid

[nrh]

patlabor
patlabor 2
sky crawlers
ghost in the shell 2: innocence
avalon

has anyone seen his english language film garm wars: the last druid?

[john ryan]

seen 10

1. ghost in the shell 2: innocence
2. ghost in the shell
3. the red spectacles
4. garm wars: the last druid
5. patlabor 2

[wba]

has anyone seen his english language film garm wars: the last druid?

nope, but I'd guess it should be as brilliant as his polish language film Avalon.

[greennui]

Angel's Egg
Ghost in the Shell

[john ryan]

Just watched Garm Wars. Definitely worth it for the Oshii fans. I struggled with the visual palette for the first 20 minutes or so. There were moments that reminded me of late 90's computer animated children's TV shows (like Beast Wars), and there were moments that were totally gorgeous.

[...]

Heh. I just started to watch that too, but good lord, what a terrible title and that info dump to begin the movie is really a bit much and hard to take seriously. Eight tribes with goofy names, war, contaminated world, three tribes left, one controls the land, the other the air, and the last & weakest provides intel for the earth guys being the info group, the gods that created the eight tribes have left and the druids who knew them are dead, except, wait! the earth guys find/capture one last druid during a fight with the airish folk! And we're off...

The look of the movie is about as complicated, being that weird cross between animation and live action, feeling a bit like neither and both at the same time with the screen seeming both busy and empty at the same time. It's not out of place for an Oshii movie, so I'll probably stick with it for a while as I'm at work and can't continue the To until I get home.

Oh, and there's a dog, well, a Gula, according to the movie, which is to all appearances a bassett hound, but a holy creature of some sort, who on rare occasions provides blessing to some lucky few by sniffing at them, allowing for pets, and sitting up and begging when the Gula is really feeling it. This saves Khara (22 or 23 I'm not sure which since they're clones or clone-like beings) of the Columba, the air people, from being snuffed by Skellig 58 of the Briga, the earth folk, with the actions of teh Gula translated by Wydd of the Kumtak the info tribe as "Even an obstinate Briga like him knows it is a grave sin to kill one who's been blessed by a Gula." Thus setting the core group, one from each remaining tribe, that somehow will set aside their differences, learn to get along, and travel together with Nascien, the last of the druids, to the druid's land to find why Diarne, their god, created the Garms, which are all those who make up the various tribes, and why Diarne then abandoned them. I can hardly wait to find out!

[wba]

Hahaha! Great write-up greg! Sounds like Oshii!

Also what John says sounds intriguing to me, cause I would have thought the look to be "terrible" throughout.

[flip]

Seen 3:

st gloede - you can pick our next director if you like! not sure when i'll start that poll, maybe tomorrow, maybe friday.

[St. Gloede]

Thanks, and the extremely excrusiation look at who the hell has the votes continues. As usual I'll hang Okamoto up there just in case someone decides to watch 1 or 2 more (or an unknown benefactor stumbles in) .

I tried Zoltan Fabri before as well, right?

So, hmmm.

Wait, do my eyes deceive me? Did we never do Wong Kar-Wai?

[wba]

I have:

7 Okamoto
2 Fabri
9 Wong

[brian d]

4 fabri, 10 wong, 3 okamoto

[flip]

Wong Kar-Wai will definitely work, but if there are a couple more people with 7+ Okamoto, we can go with him, since I'm being a bit more relaxed about views these days. But if only three people have seen very many, he won't make for much of a poll. And if a few people have seen a lot of Fabri, that will work too.

[Evelyn Library P.I.]

I did an Okamoto double bill the other day, but that only gets me to 3 total. Hope to get to 7+ soon to help out by next round, if not yet.

[...]

I've got over 7 Okamotos, but if Evelyn is going to catch up, maybe wait a little? I'd offer him as well when there are enough people with views to make it worth doing.

[rischka]

i've got 7 okamoto
9 wkw
3 fabri

[Evelyn Library P.I.]

I'd (probably) watch Okamoto flicks when the poll is on, so no need to wait on my account.

[flip]

okay, well then it seems like at least four people have seen 7+ okamoto, so that should work. i've decided to wait til friday to start that poll

[St. Gloede]

4th times the charm.

Brilliant!

[...]

Finshed Garm Wars: The Last Druid and it gets even more Oshii-ey as it goes. The soundtrack is lush and a bit excessive, the visuals, as John said, become likewise more engrossing, and the story picks up some wacky metaphysical concepts that hint towards some intended connection to reality that is, as usual, vague, overwrought, but kinda enticing. The actors become more interesting too, though still mostly keeping to the Oshii dry minimalist approach.

The visuals are more pared down than in the animes, with mostly just landscapes to work with until near the end, but Oshii uses a heightened and somewhat unusual color palette to make the images stand out. Lot's of blues and, later, some greens that are heavy on the blue side to set off the characters, the main one of which, Khara 23, is dressed in a red suit that also have a strange tint to it something like a candy metallic feel. The structure of the second half of the movie is split into two more parts. Part one was mostly what I described earlier, with more dialogue to get to the decision to find the druid's place.

Part Two is the journey there, which is mostly shot in fog lighted to make it look like they're moving but with one overnight camp stop where Khara and Skellig discuss things. Skellig questions Khara about what it's like to touch the Gula (basset hound) and if it changed her, which is pretty ridiculous in a fun way and it gives opportunity for yet more exposition about how the Garm have no memories and are created for their seemingly endless war. The movie is almost all exposition, really, like 90 percent of the lines are either explaining something to each other and the audience to further the plot and ideas or is some reaction to that info. The language is likewise stilted, Skellig, for example, frequently says things like "This Briga" when referencing himself and all of them show minimal emotion.

Part three takes them to the Druid's forest where Oshii gets to bust out some stronger visuals and some shocks, all of which are fun and lovely. There are, of course, giant massively destructive robots that arise and a tank fight, all done well in this live action/anime hybrid style, and finally a complete explanation of why the druid led them there is given (It was a trap!) and the Garms history is provided as even more giant robots rise from the ground to rid this world of all the Garm. Then the movie ends without resolving anything, all that exposition to set up the age which is about to vanish for something new. It's not unlike like the opening credit sequences some movies use to introduce you to the world of the film, like Black Panther did as one example, except that's all Garm Wars: The Last Druid is, one long introduction to a story that you won't see play out. I gotta like Oshii's moxie in making it though, so I'm gonna give it a vote instead of Skycrawlers just for that.

[flip]

I'm going to tabulate this poll some time between now and Tuesday, but even if I do it today, I'll take ballots up until Tuesday. Anyway, closing fairly soon, so if you wanted to vote, please do so in the next couple of days.

[thoxans]

It's not unlike like the opening credit sequences some movies use to introduce you to the world of the film

this is exactly how i felt after yimou’s shadow ended, tho i didn’t express it as well! also, this is how sujeeth’s saaho begins before entering into a world that really doesn’t need that backstory at all cuz it kinda sorta goes off and does its own thing, with only tangentially (at best) circling back round to that intro. neither of these films have anything to do with this poll, but thought it was interesting nonetheless

[karl]

I got 12 Zoltan Fabri.

[flip]

only nine films got votes, so to get to a top ten, i'll need some more votes -- if anyone has seen 9 or more oshii, and wants to vote for an oshii film that didn't make the list, please post below!

results

1. Ghost in the Shell 2: Innocence (2004) -- 12 pts
2. The Red Spectacles (1987) -- 9 pts
2. Patlabor 2 (1993) -- 9 pts
2. Ghost in the Shell (1995) -- 9 pts
5. Patlabor (1989) -- 7 pts
6. The Sky Crawlers (2008) -- 6 pts
7. Angel's Egg (1985) -- 3 pts
7. Garm Wars: The Last Druid (2014) -- 3 pts
7. Avalon (2001) -- 3 pts
10. StrayDog: Kerberos Panzer Cops (1991) - 0.1 pts
10. Dallos (1983) - 0.1 pts