1937 Poll 2.0

[sally]

fully intended to watch la mort du cygne (marie epstein written) but a) it's crappy quality and b) i hate ballet movies, so don't think i'm gonna make it, but someone should watch it!

[rischka]

fully intended to watch la mort du cygne (marie epstein written) but a) it's crappy quality and b) i hate ballet movies, so don't think i'm gonna make it, but someone should watch it!

i'm on it thx for the tip!

kg says this should be a co-director credit for marie epstein. her credits were often unceremoniously scrubbed

[sally]

yeah, should watch it just for that but ballet ugh

instead paid the price for my unreasonable prejudices by watching what turned out to be a very dull NextCoMo transition movie

bílá nemoc / the white disease (aka skeleton on horseback) - hugo haas

notable solely for its association with jiri's legendary (and far more fun) literary exploits: https://sites.google.com/site/drgalenova/home/contents

[rischka]

condition confirmed horrible. it's a wonderful film and i updated marie's credit



there's a deep empathy for children in all her films i've seen

[karl]

kg says this should be a co-director credit for marie epstein. her credits were often unceremoniously scrubbed

Who unceremoniously scrubbed? Why? Was it the beastly Benoît-Lévy who denied her the credit? If such was his habit, it's rather odd that she would continue to work with the brute over the course of nine pictures. I also note, casting a glance at the Yootoob, that she's listed as co-director in the credits of both Itto and La Maternelle (meanwhile I can't find her anywhere in the credits for Peau de Pêche, for which she's also given co-director credit on IMDb, etc), so is it possible that, though they wrote the script together, Benoît-Lévy simply directed this picture himself? There's not much in English that I can find about the collaboration between these two; perhaps someone could shed some light.

That said, this film was my favorite that I've watched for this poll. Couldn't make it through the Belgian movie everyone's raving about here: when you have to tell the first half of the film with title cards it's a bad sign, and the rest was amateur hour all the way.

[rischka]

i can only refer you to this review

https://letterboxd.com/lucanus/film/ballerina-1937/

and comments from kg

Bessy and Chirat's Histoire du Cinéma Français 1935-1939 diplomatically states: Réalisation, scénario et dialogues: Jean Benoît-Lévy et Marie Epstein, d'après une nouvelle de Paul Morand.

Tulard seems to agree that she was co-director.

also wikipedia lists it as a co-directorial effort

Co-director with Jean Benoît-Lévy
Given the collaborative relationship between Benoît-Lévy and Epstein, it is difficult to determine Epstein's exact contribution to these films. Epstein likely served as a writer and assistant for some films and as co-director for others.

Il était une fois trois amis (1928)
Âmes d'enfants (1928)
Peau de Pêche (1928)
Maternité (1929)
Heart of Paris (1932)
La Maternelle (1933)
Itto (1934)
Hélène (1936)
Ballerina (La mort du cygne) (1937)
Altitude 3200 (1938)
Le feu de paille (1939)

Assistant director
Unless otherwise noted, all films are directed by Jean Benoît-Lévy.

Coeur fidèle (Jean Epstein, 1923)
Agence matrimoniale (1952)
Le congrès de la dance (1952)
Deux maîtres pour un valet (1952)
Le poignard (1952)
Sous les ponts (1952)

i don't read french. i already adjusted the credits but if you want to change it back feel free. if this was a male director he had amazing insight into the minds of little girls (not impossible!) so kudos for that. apparently he only mentioned marie once - in a footnote in his autobiography. i can't imagine why anyone would erase women from film history either but we know that it happened.

[rischka]

angel (lubitsch)
make way for tomorrow (mccarey)
humanity and paper balloons (yamanaka)
green fields (ulmer)
the great garrick (whale)

the evil eye (dekeukeleire)
the awful truth (mccarey)
ballerina (epstein/benoit-levy)
the edge of the world (powell)
easy living (leisen)

forget love for now (shimizu)
a star athlete (shimizu)
children in the wind (shimizu)
the prisoner of zenda (cromwell)
tovarich (litvak)

nothing sacred (wellman)
marked woman (bacon)
the tale of the fox (starewicz)
history is made at night (borzage)
street angel (yuan)

[sally]

https://twitter.com/sigurdson_chris/sta ... 5303054337

[rischka]

ha! the commentary said it was janet gaynor. canadian erasure maybe he just didn't tell them apparently disney didn't give him a credit either!

[karl]

i can only refer you to this review

https://letterboxd.com/lucanus/film/ballerina-1937/

and comments from kg

Bessy and Chirat's Histoire du Cinéma Français 1935-1939 diplomatically states: Réalisation, scénario et dialogues: Jean Benoît-Lévy et Marie Epstein, d'après une nouvelle de Paul Morand.

Tulard seems to agree that she was co-director.

also wikipedia lists it as a co-directorial effort

Co-director with Jean Benoît-Lévy
Given the collaborative relationship between Benoît-Lévy and Epstein, it is difficult to determine Epstein's exact contribution to these films. Epstein likely served as a writer and assistant for some films and as co-director for others.

i don't read french. i already adjusted the credits but if you want to change it back feel free. if this was a male director he had amazing insight into the minds of little girls (not impossible!) so kudos for that. apparently he only mentioned marie once - in a footnote in his autobiography. i can't imagine why anyone would erase women from film history either but we know that it happened.

Aw, I don't want to change back the credits, nor am I denying that Epstein could have been denied a credit where credit was due. I'm simply suggesting her lack of co-director listing could perhaps be for some other reason than that of the erasing hand of the evil patriarchy. The LB review seems little more than hearsay ("The story goes that...") and opinion ("The screenplay is clearly the work of Epstein..."; "She also edited this film alone..."). The opinion part, that Epstein clearly wrote the screenplay herself (thus the "moral didactic" Benoît-Lévy hogged a co-writer credit he wasn't entitled to at the same time denying Epstein credit for her directorial work) because the film bears "strong thematic and narrative links to her first screenplays," sends me to IMDb, where I find that prior to the Benoît-Lévy collaboration she co-wrote (note the "co-") three of her brother's films: a woman wants to leave her drunken fella for a dockworker (Coeur fidèle); a "critique of wealth and bourgeois hypocrisy" about chronic gamblers (Le double amour); a doctor falls in love with his deceased brother's mistress, unaware that she was the cause of the brother's suicide (Six et demi onze). None of these, judging from the IMDb synopses - I've only seen Coeur fidèle - has "strong thematic and narrative links" to La Mort du Cygne. However, there are such links to the other Benoît-Lévy collaborations, from which some might be inclined to surmise that Benoît-Lévy was an influence on Epstein rather than the other way around. To my knowledge the only extant pre-Marie film of his is Pasteur (1922), co-directed with Jean Epstein, so I'm not sure how the author of the LB piece can so confidently judge that Jean prior to Marie was a "moral didactic" hack - though I suspect that it's because the author of the review also desires to see the erasing hand of the evil patriarchy everywhere evident in early film history and has no qualms about making things up to "prove" it. What we do know is that Benoît-Lévy's background was in documentary films, which certainly could explain the pre-neo "realism" of the Benoît-Lévy-Epstein pictures. And could they have had a falling out that would account for the mere footnote mention of Epstein in Benoît-Lévy's autobiography?

Then again, did Benoît-Lévy even write an autobiography? Try typing "Jean Benoît-Lévy autobiographie" in a Google search.

Wikipedia admits that it's "difficult to determine Epstein's exact contribution," but given that she's listed as co-director on at least two other Benoît-Lévy films and co-scriptwriter on La Mort du Cygne, could it be that she was simply co-scriptwriter on La Mort du Cygne?

The "Réalisation, scénario et dialogues: Jean Benoît-Lévy et Marie Epstein" in the French history book is the best case for Epstein's co-director credit (and probably why she's listed as co-director on IMDb, etc.), though I'd still like to know what the evidence is, especially since "revisionist" histories were quite popular at the book's publication date in the mid-eighties, as they remain today.

And now:

GRAND ILLUSION (Renoir)
STRAITS OF LOVE AND HATE (Mizoguchi)
THE EDGE OF THE WORLD (Powell)
FORGET LOVE FOR NOW (Shimizu)

HARVEST (Pagnol)
WHAT DID THE LADY FORGET? (Ozu)
ANGEL (Lubitsch)
HUMANITY AND PAPER BALLOONS (Yamanaka)

LADY KILLER (Grémillon)
DEATH OF THE SWAN aka BALLERINA (Benoît-Lévy and possibly Epstein)
SOULS AT SEA (Hathaway)
HISTORY IS MADE AT NIGHT (Borzage)

CHILDREN IN THE WIND (Shimizu)
MAKE WAY FOR TOMORROW (McCarey)
WEE WILLIE WINKIE (Ford)
STAGE DOOR (La Cava)

YOU ONLY LIVE ONCE (Lang)
KNIGHT WITHOUT ARMOUR (Feyder)
SIGNOR MAX (Camerini)
CONFESSION (May)

[rischka]

ok karl i don't want to fight. believe whatever you like. they're both dead now so i don't suppose we'll ever know the truth. i guess it was sexist of me to assume that the woman was the one exhibiting deep empathy w children in peau de peche and la maternelle and this film.

like w racism, it's easy to believe the patriarchy isn't real when it doesn't directly affect you. i'm the one who changed her credit at imdb too

i admit i get a bit salty sometimes so ... happy new year karl! are you still in the states

to me on jan 1

[sally]

well, i guess we can all see fascists looming for this year...

final ballot

green fields - edgar g ulmer, jacob ben-ami
the rainbow pass - jacques tourneur
the great garrick - james whale
the edge of the world - michael powell
street angel - muzhi yuan
hortobágy - george hoellering
the evil eye - charles dekeukeleire
juha - nyrki tapiovaara
le mot de cambronne - sacha guitry
désiré - sacha guitry
angel - ernst lubitsch
the trio's engagements - yasujirō shimazu
don't tell your wife about it - minoru shibuya
the golden demon - hiroshi shimizu
a star athlete - hiroshi shimizu
il signor max - mario camerini
souls at sea - henry hathaway

[der kulterer]

https://kinometer.com/?list=490

The Evil Eye (Charles Dekeukeleire, 1937, 74m)
The Adventure of a Good Citizen (Stefan Themerson, Franciszka Themerson, 1937, 8m)
The Edge of the World (Michael Powell, 1937, 81m)
Sara Learns Manners (Gustaf Molander, 1937, 74m)
A Bird Who Performs Military Service (Jan Svoboda, 1937, 16m)
Glens Falls Sequence (Douglass Crockwell, 1937, 8m)
Trade Tattoo (Len Lye, 1937, 5m)

Even: As You and I (Roger Barlow, Harry Hay, LeRoy Robbins, 1937, 12m)
Monsieur Fantômas (Ernst Moerman, 1937, 17m)
Escape (Mary Ellen Bute, Bill Nemeth, Ted Nemeth, 1937, 4m)
Morality above All Else (Martin Frič, 1937, 80m)
Fury in Paradise (Eduardo de Castro, 1937, 64m)
The Quack (Michał Waszyński, 1937, 100m)
Skeleton on Horseback (Hugo Haas, 1937, 103m)

[rischka]

well, i guess we can all see fascists looming for this year..

let's hope we can hold them off this time

[rischka]

i forgot about the powell. gonna edit my list so it can get higher

[lineuphere]

i forgot about the powell. gonna edit my list so it can get higher

Don't forget about "Pearls of the Crown" too! I see you "hearted" that on Letterboxd. No pressure.

[lineuphere]

I watched "Ballerina" based on the discussions here. Glad I did. Fun ride. I'm married to a dancer and it all tracked.

Final:

La grande illusion - Jean Renoir
The Pearls of the Crown - Sacha Guitry
Lady Killer - Jean Grémillon
Make Way for Tomorrow - Leo McCarey

Angel - Ernst Lubitsch
The Thirteen - Mikhail Romm
The Old Mill - Wilfred Jackson
Ballerina - Jean Benoît-Lévy, Marie Epstein

Humanity and Paper Balloons - Sadao Yamanaka
Pépé le Moko - Julien Duvivier
The Awful Truth - Leo McCarey
Easy Living - Mitchell Leisen

Condottieri - Luis Trenker, Giacomo Gentilomo, Anton Giulio Majano
Juha - Nyrki Tapiovaara
Regain - Marcel Pagnol
Confession - Joe May

History Is Made at Night - Frank Borzage
The Fourth Dimension - Jean Painlevé, A.-P. Dufour
Un carnet de bal - Julien Duvivier
Song of the Flower Basket - Heinosuke Gosho

[Evelyn Library P.I.]

The Prisoner of Zenda (John Cromwell)
Il signor Max (Mario Camerini)
One Hundred Men and a Girl (Henry Koster)
Music for Madame (John G. Blystone)

Around the Village Green (Evelyn Cherry, Marion Taylor)
Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs (Disney)
Easy Living (Mitchell Leisen)
The Woods Are Full of Cuckoos (Frank Tashlin)

The Great Garrick (James Whale)
Courage of the West (Joseph H. Lewis)
Rustlers' Valley (Nate Watt)
The Last Train from Madrid (James P. Hogan)

The Last Gangster (Edward Ludwig)
Girls Can Play (Lambert Hillyer)
A Damsel in Distress (George Stevens)
Heidi (Allan Dwan)

It's Love I'm After (Archie Mayo)
Farewell Topsails (Humphrey Jennings)
House Cleaning Blues (Dave Fleischer)
The New Deal Show (Dave Fleischer)

[...]

Humanity and Paper Balloons
Children of the Wind
Drole de Drame
Street Angel
A Star Athlete

Prisoner of Zenda
Night Must Fall
Stage Door
Straits of Love and Hate
Glen Falls Sequence

Angel
Non-Stop New York
History in Made at Night
The Edge of the World
The Pearls of the Crown

Dance Program
Dead End
Shall We Dance
Park avenue Logger
100 Men and a Girl

[Lencho of the Apes]

Almas Rebeldes - de Anda
Angel - Lubitsch
Green Fields - Ulmer
Humanity And Paper Balloons
La Mancha De Sangre
Mr. Fantomas -
Le Roman De Reynard - Starewicz, Starewicz
A Woman's Sorrows - Naruse
You Only Live Once
Young And Innocent
Yoshiwara - Ophuls

[rischka]

i forgot about the powell. gonna edit my list so it can get higher

https://scfzforum.org/phpBB3/posting.ph ... =5&p=41431#

Don't forget about "Pearls of the Crown" too! I see you "hearted" that on Letterboxd. No pressure.

sadly i don't remember it at all. glad you liked la mort du cygne :swan:

[St. Gloede]

I ended up seeing Ballerina btw, strong recommendation even if it did not end up making my list.

[ororama]

Nothing Sacred (William A. Wellman)
A Star Is Born (William A. Wellman)
Pépé le Moko (Julien Duvivier)
You Only Live Once (Fritz Lang)
The Awful Truth (Leo McCarey)
The Grand Illusion (Jean Renoir)
Easy Living (Mitchell Leisen)
Stella Dallas (King Vidor)
Young and Innocent (Alfred Hitchcock)
Marked Woman (Lloyd Bacon)
Dead End (William Wyler)
They Won't Forget (Mervyn LeRoy)
Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs (David Hand et. al.)
The Spanish Earth (Joris Ivens)
Think Fast, Mr. Moto (Norman Foster)
The Edge of the World (Michael Powell)
Stand-In (Tay Garnett)
The Dybbuk (Michal Waszynski)
Stage Door (Gregory La Cava)
Street Angel (Yuan Muzhi)

[Evelyn Library P.I.]

RESULTS

Ballots: 15. Films voted for: 126.

1. Angel (Ernst Lubitsch) / 34

2. Ninjō kami fūsen / Humanity and Paper Balloons (Sadao Yamanaka) / 33

3. La Grande Illusion (Jean Renoir) / 23

4. Make Way for Tomorrow (Leo McCarey) / 21.5

5. The Edge of the World (Michael Powell) / 21

6. Easy Living (Mitchell Leisen) / 18.5

7. The Prisoner of Zenda (John Cromwell) / 18

8. Kaze no naka no kodomo / Children in the Wind (Hiroshi Shimizu) / 17

— Pépé le Moko (Julien Duvivier) / 17

10. Ma lu tian shi / Street Angel (Muzhi Yuan) / 16

— You Only Live Once (Fritz Lang) / 16

12. Stage Door / 15.5
13. Le Roman de Renard / 14.5
14. Young and Innocent / 14
15. The Awful Truth / 12.5
— Drôle de drame 12.5
— Het kwade oog / The Evil Eye / 12.5
18. Il signor Max / 12
19. Les Perles de la couronne / 11.5
20. History Is Made at Night / 11
— Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs / 11

22. Glen Falls Sequence / 10.5
— The Great Garrick / 10.5
— Green Fields / 10.5
— La Mort du Cygne / 10.5
— Nothing Sacred / 10.5
— One Hundred Men and a Girl / 10.5
28. A Star Athlete / 10
29. Dead End / 9.5
30. The Old Mill / 9
— Souls at Sea / 9

32. Straits of Love and Hate / 8.5
33. Juha / 8
Lady Killer / 8
35. Forget Love for Now 7.5
— Marked Woman / 7.5
— Non-Stop New York / 7.5
— Tovarich / 7.5
39. Condottieri / 7
— Regain / 7
— The Thirteen / 7

42. Kid Galahad / 6
— Stella Dallas / 6
44. Un carnet de bal / 5.5
45. Der Herrscher / 5
— Monsieur Fantomas / 5
— Morality Above All Else / 5
— Music for Madame / 5
— Sant Tukaram / 5
50. Night Must Fall / 4.5

[rischka]

https://letterboxd.com/rischka/list/1937-poll-20/

and another nice list. cheers everyone. and thx evelyn